Top 10 Reasons to Not Believe in God
May 19, 2007 8:29 pm Philosophy & GodI do not mean to offend anyone’s beliefs or religious views here, I just reinterpret some of the philosophical questions that have been raised.
10. War
Religion is basically the cause of most wars, ancient and present. For example, the crusades were responsible for the holy wars between Christians and Muslims. The Pope actually sanctioned the attacks on Jerusalem to “reclaim” the city from Muslim rule. Even today, the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict can be argued that it is based on religion, Judaism vs. Islam.
9. Omnipotence Paradox
This paradox asks a question that is contradictory for God. For example, “Can God create an object so heavy that even God cannot lift it?” or “Can God ask a question so difficult that even he cannot answer it?”
8. Cosmological Argument
This argument asks a question which only ends up involved with circular logic. “If God created the Universe, which must have been created, then who or what created God, and so on.
7. Suffering
Suffering is similar to the problem of evil, whereas how can God allow suffering in the universe if he is an all-loving being. Everyday, we see thousands of people die everyday, diseases such as E. coli spreading rapidly, and civil unrest in places such as the Middle East.
6. No Reason to Exist
Since knowledge, feelings, desire, etc. are all human traits, God does not have any reason to feel All-loving, or he has no reason to create humans for his own “personal satisfaction”.
5. Free Will
The argument from free will asks if God is an omniscient being, how free will can exist. If God has all the knowledge of future events, then how can humans be free to choose the events that affect them? For example, if I were to choose between wearing a red shirt or blue shirt, but God already knows I am going to choose the red shirt, then how did I really have a choice in choosing the red shirt since God already knew which one I would choose?
4. Varying Religions
Since all major religions give different examples of what God wants and who God is, the argument can be made that it is impossible for all religions to be correct in describing God.
3. Poor Design Argument
This basically asks how an omnipotent, omnibenevolent God can create imperfect beings in an imperfect universe. Organisms created by a perfect God should reflect the qualities of their creator. Scientists have used evolution to enforce this line of thought against topics such as the argument from intelligent design.
2. Problem of Evil
A common topic in philosophy, the problem of evil deals with the fact that if God is omnipotent and omniscient, how can he allow evil to exist in the world. The problem implies that there is a contradiction with God’s attributes.
1. Faithlessness & Depression
Perhaps you have been feeling sad for a long period of time and you begin to question your faith. Significant events in your life can make you wonder if God would actually allow those harmful moments to take place towards you.
August 6th, 2007 at 5:45 am
“7. Suffering
Suffrage is similar to the problem of evil, … ”
Suffrage?
Evil is associated with the right to vote?? Surely not.
August 6th, 2007 at 9:54 am
Didn’t realize the difference right away, thanks for noticing.
August 6th, 2007 at 6:59 pm
Some of these reasons are irrelevant. The only thing that matters is whether or not religious theories are true or false. Any theory that is based on false premises is a false theory. Since all religious theories are based on unnatural assumptions, all religious theories are false. No one has to prove that they are false, they are false by definition. God is defined by all religions to have unnatural characteristics, therefore God cannot exist in a natural universe. No one has to prove that unnatural things don’t exist. They can’t exist because of their own contradictory characteristics. Three times one cannot equal one regardless of what any religion asserts. The laws of nature do not change and never will. Unnatural objects or unnatural events are impossible by definition. If someone wants to believe in the impossible, don’t argue with them. Just laugh.
August 7th, 2007 at 1:39 pm
Stop blaming religion for wars. This is the most ignorant factoid atheists love to throw out but it’s not true. Sure religion can account for a lot of the great horror that man-kind has wrought upon itself but to put most of the blame on religion for human conflict driven strife is really stupid. Or should I say it is at least as stupid as religious adherents claiming Nazi Germany was an atheist society, devoid of all moral beliefs because it had no religion.
August 7th, 2007 at 2:24 pm
I never said religion is soley responsible for everything in war, as all leaders have a hand in conflicts they choose to wage.
I’m not saying I believe in every point I make, as I stated at the very top of the list, I reinterpret the reasons.
I also never said I was atheist, and I created a list about reasons to believe in God.
August 7th, 2007 at 4:23 pm
“Stop blaming religion for wars”
Why? As was pointed out by the author, it IS the cause for most wars in the history of mankind. He also either failed to mention the current war between the US and the Middle East or was trying to be politically correct. In either case, we are in the midst of yet another holy war. The christians like to just dismiss that and say “it’s not a war against islam”, but just dismissing facts does not make them false. The basis behind the aggression we’re facing is religious in nature. The response is also religious in nature, if we just listen to our “leaders”.
However, you counter his claim by saying these horrors were brought upon man by himself. Since religion is an invention of man, it can’t be immediately dismissed as a reason for war. The author did not state GOD was the cause of wars, RELIGION was. Religion has nothing to do with god. Religion has always been about forcing one’s in-born moral code on everyone else.
You were, however, correct on one point: Nazi Germany was not an atheist nation, it was a christian nation with a christian leader following his interpretation of the christian bible. Which leads to the #0 reason to not believe in god: his inability to speak clearly despite being omnipotent. The words in his book have been misinterpreted to such extremes over the history of mankind (not to mention present day: the KKK, Jonestown, Waco, etc), it boggles the mind that anyone can find anything good in them. When you look at someone like Mother Theresa who read the same book Adolf Hitler did and examine the differences in interpretation they each came up with….wow…even the worst lawyer in the world can come up with a contract that’s fairly air-tight and not subject to such wide variation of interpretation, I’d certainly think an omnipotent god (who is also omniscient and therefore can foresee these misinterpretations) would have been a lot less stupid in his authorship.
August 7th, 2007 at 4:35 pm
No one seems to have a counter for 1 and 2…
August 7th, 2007 at 11:20 pm
Religion has long provided a pretext for war, an excuse; but in the end all wars are fought over resources: land, treasure, slaves, oil, water.
The Nazis were expressly up front about it: lebensraum.
Even the Crusades were MUCH more about money (control of trade routes back to Asia, looting Jerusalem, and the middle east) than religion. This is why the FIRST thing the Crusaders did was sack Constantinople, then a Christian city, the Eastern capital of the Holy Roman Empire
The Paletinian/Israeli conflict is *expressly* about land (and increasingly, water) Religion has almost nothing to do with it.
August 8th, 2007 at 2:15 am
I believe in a higher power that has nothing what-so-ever to do with any made-made religions. This higher power is beyond our comprehension, and not necessarily ‘one’. I doubt it is omnipotent, either, but I also don’t believe we are able to/supposed to understand it at this stage in our existence.
August 8th, 2007 at 8:48 am
#
Blang said,
August 7th, 2007 at 4:35 pm
No one seems to have a counter for 1 and 2…
Both 1 and 2 are based primary around a single concept of God, that being the Christian one.
1. Can be countered by freewill, and by a concept of God that does not interfere in life on Earth.
2. Can be countered by the fact that human morlity is not a fixed thing, and can and does change from time to time, culture to culture and sociaty to sociaty.
In fact all ten reasons are fairly basic and count soley on one interpretation on what God is or is not.
August 9th, 2007 at 4:49 am
BruceJ you couldn’t be more wrong.
I’m from Israel and the conflict’s roots are in the bible, yea right now it’s the palestinians ambition to take back the land of their fathers (nothing about water, we even provide their electricity)
but we wouldnt have been here unless jews everywhere had dreamt of the promised land of Israel.
And Jihad has a lot to do with the reasons this conflict refuses to end, just as the religious settelers are fanatic that all of israel is ours including the Palestinian territories.
August 13th, 2007 at 8:40 pm
The almighty lords of dualism: Ahura Mazda, Yahweh, God, and Allah are ethical equivalents of comic book super-villains.
And this pulp fiction enjoys fanatical cult followings.
Yet we shouldn’t mistake political ideology for religious belief.
Wherever ideology reduces to theology, as in the Southern U.S. or its sister region Pakistan, secular politics does not exist.
Secularism corrupts. Tolerance capitulates to evil. Only puritanism prevails.
But, the holy text is merely pretext. Ideology masquerading as religion bamboozles the masses, the media. Telemullahs there, televangelists here.
Real terrorist threats: undermining the Constitution, trashing biological science, and perverting education to suit a disgusting Xian ideology of social control and cultural domination by right-wing military-politico-religionists.
Home-grown Xo-fascists frighten me much more than all so-called Islamo-fascists combined.
1st-circle
copyright asserted 2007
August 15th, 2007 at 8:27 pm
Not a very good list. I’ve seen far better arguments.
Argument #9, for instance, is simply nonsense. A rock that an omnipotent God can’t carry is a logical impossibility. You might as well ask, “Can God create a circular square?”
Even an omnipotent being can’t do things outside of the logically impossible.
August 20th, 2007 at 5:32 pm
My questions are:
What relation is between God ang his own existence?
Is God forced to exist (be in existence)?
Can God end his existence by his decision?
Is not therefore Existence of God superior to the God?
Waht is God’s meaning of life (his existence)?
Does anybody know answers to this questions?
August 28th, 2007 at 1:25 am
A perfect society cannot exist because we unlike God are not perfect.In example we cannot control our own children even though we may have more knowledge or experience. We experience suffering and death in order to appreciate the bliss and eternal peace once we reach heaven.We cannot blame God for all or any of our mistakes any more than we can blame our own parents for the choices we make in our own lives. We are respnsible for our own futures and only by believing in Him will we make the right choices to prosper. there is one God and no matter the religion there is one God at the core.Evil is the absence of God. God is the absence of evil.Those who wish harm to the human race do so because there is no Godly love in their heart. It is by faith alone that we withstand and survive that which evil lays upon us. God helps us through our troubled times because he is our Father and he loves us. As would any loving parent when their child is in trouble. God let’s us interpret our own meanings so that we may find OUR way through life. You give a child a toy and it’s theirs to do with as they wish. You can tell them the right way and the wrong way. In the end they either destroy it or protect it. As a race we have done both. We live in this world not God.God is not religion. He just is. We , as a society, invented religion. No where in the bible does it say this is ” muslim” or this is “chritianity”. It simply depicts events and submissions of those who lived through those times and their recording of what transpired. To each his own. If you don’t believe in Him that is your “God given right”.
August 28th, 2007 at 1:33 am
To Mr Neutron:
Why does anyone exist? To experience anything other than nonexistence ?
Are you forced to exist? Can you not end it if you so choose?
God is the meaning of superior.
The bible says that when we die all questions are answered.
personally, I love a great mystery.
August 29th, 2007 at 2:32 am
God is great.end of story.
November 21st, 2007 at 8:31 pm
hey grasshopper you ididot, suffrage is the right to vote…
December 1st, 2007 at 2:19 pm
I have always felt that, on the subject of God, you should not try to convince others of what you believe. Even my children. I just tell people that I put one more “o” in my God…hence…Good. ie. Right and wrong. I believe that 99% of humans no what that is. Except during rush hour traffic. Then it goes down to 75% for some reason.
April 6th, 2008 at 8:33 am
I’m sixteen and I have always took an interest in this argument and I have come up with the following, it is only my opinion you do not need to share it however my opinion is backed up by years of scientific evidence.
All Bibles and religions are man-made, Matter is not created; it cannot be destroyed; it is self-existent; it is the only substance, and nothing else exists therefore It may be that our role on this planet is not to worship God, but to create him.
June 7th, 2008 at 10:15 pm
I have thoroughly read every response on this page….and honestly I feel something needs to be said here…kind of like one of those points that make you cringe…so here goes….
God …think about it….how can we attest to a perfect being…being imperfect ourselves. Who are we to determmine the validity of a perfect beings existence given we being far from LOGICALLY and RATIONALLY capable of disproving something such as God…If we have so many questions ourselves think about why we have to ask….if there was no God the universe would not be so confusing….we would not have so many gaps in our explanation of our surroundings and even our own race.
If questions arise…this of all things proves there has to be a God……he is all things…I’m looking at this from the outside in because honestly there are millions are better ways to word what I’m trying to transmit here.
The complexity that surrounds God is all the more lapse in our conscience, all the more food for thought, all the more room for evolving….all the more room to APPRECIATE his love…..
Love is the most blatant path God has left us to him from here on Earth.
It’s just the simple things tend to sway the intellectual away, tend to sway most people away because “there has to be more”.
Well, here’s what I say, we are here….why is not for any of us to think we can explain…I mean we can try lol….but what I’m saying is God has left us with many hints of his intelligence….our DNA for example would take billions of years for its make up to be as evolved as it is today…
Where we are today has too much chance and stroke of luck involved…ie Earths perfect atmosphere with its perfect balance of gases to supply life…..etc
So the SIMPLE THINGS that are easiest to understand are stepping stones to understanding what we dont….and to me its obvious that love is God’s way of helping our confused minds breaking through this mold of universal curiousity and confusion.
The greatest scientific intellectual breakthroughs of anything concerning anything come about out of love for the topic. The greatest of the great are driven by the love they have for what they did.
So….did I answer what God is? heck no…but is God there?…why of course
July 11th, 2008 at 11:17 pm
Not bad, but alot of this seem to revolve around “God can’t exist because we don’t exactly understand Him/It.” I don’t understand atoms or why they function as particles one minuet and waves as the next, but I don’t say that means they don’t exist.
August 15th, 2008 at 11:09 pm
Most wars have been about gaining wealth, territory, and power. Hitler, Napoleon, the Romans, the Greeks, Hannibal, Genghis Khan, and so forth were after material gain. In fact, there is at least one area in Isreal(the Jezreel Valley) that has been a battle field for 4000 years because of it is a stragetic route and a fertile valley, not because of any religious significance. Religion is only a cover up for greed.
September 15th, 2008 at 8:10 am
I agree with 1… Something really awefull recently happend to me, and i ask to christains, if god is real and he loves all so much, and he knows what path people are going to take before they take it, then why didnt he protect me from this ‘event’?
October 19th, 2008 at 11:41 pm
God put on earth to gloify him. he also gave us a choose to beleive in him and be with him for eternity. or people can go to hell like you are
November 14th, 2008 at 3:03 pm
Kat,
To comment on your question as to why God didn’t ‘protect’ you from this event can easily be answered if you are a parent: If you shield your child from life, they will not have one. Ask all the ‘helicopter’ parents these days who hover over their kids and try to eliminate ALL injustices and pains from their lives. Their kids have no idea how to cope with these things when they grow up- look how kids freak out when they fail tests, sporting events, etc. because they never learned how to lose, deal with it, and how to come back from it. Loss is the only way to allow a person to appreciate what they HAVE.
Now lets go over these 10 reasons:
10. Wars are not based on religion. They are based on people who misunderstand religion and pervert it to mean what THEY want it to mean. This happens in all facets of human life. We all interpret rules the way we want, in order to best benefit our agendas. If your agenda is contrary to that of the rules, then the outcome of your pursuit is not in line with what is intended to happen according to the original rule. So wars are waged by people perverting religion to make it benefit them.
9. Omnipotence/omniscience is not something to be understood by those who are not. Only those who are can fully grasp the concept of omnipotence/omniscience. This argument is like a lab mouse questioning the pertinence of the experiment it is participating in. Pointless.
8. This argument debases itself, if matter cannot be created- how it is here? If you can answer that with out including a creator, the leap of faith taken in your argument is a much great leap than mine. “Uh, it’s here cuz it’s here. You can’t argue that…it’s SCIENCE!”
7. Refer to my statement to Kat. Also, if you force someone to love you and keep them from all things that may harm them, that’s called ‘rape’ and ‘kidnapping’. Evil tells you that your decisions are good for you and clouds your mind to not consider the broader ramifications of your choices. This is why bad things happen to good people, because people tend to do what is easiest for them, which is usually bad for everyone else.
6. This one escaped me. Nothing anywhere says love is a ‘human’ emotion and that God does not feel human emotions. Actually, to the contrary, most religious texts explicitly demonstrate God’s ‘human’ emotions of love, anger, and jealousy. Remember, we were ‘made in his image’.
5. This one is easy. If you’ve ever watched ‘Back to the Future’ or ‘Quantum Leap’ (I’m dating mysealf, I know!), you’d know that even though the person traveling back in time knows what the outcome will be, if the individuals are unaware of those outcomes, they still have the choice to choose without bias.
4. Duh. If you take 10 eyewitnesses to a crime, you’ll get 10 different stories. That doesn’t mean all 10 stories are wrong, or only 1 is right- right?
3. Who is to say that our DESIGN is imperfect? Maybe we are perfectly designed to be imperfect? Again, this is like the lab mouse questioning the decisions of the scientist performing the experiment. Pointless.
2. Evil is the night to Good’s day. With one, the other would not exist. Without evil, there would be no good. In order for us to have free will, we must have an option to choose. No one can do/be good without choosing to do so. And by choosing to do so, you and others reap the benefits of that choice and therefore goodness encourages further goodness. If there were no evil to juxtapose good, then there would be no choice and therefore, no free will (the rebuttal to #5).
And finally…#1!
The idea that ‘people with faith questioning that faith’ proves faith is ‘worthless/pointless’ is dumb. What if we applied this to science? If we did, we would still believe in spontaneous generation, in bleeding out illness, and that black people can’t swim because they’re missing a muscle in their back. See how that sounds? Faith is supposed to be challenged, thought through, reworked, retooled as in all endeavors that require higher thought. Not challenging your own beliefs and faith is BLIND faith, which, as we see in #10 (war), is usually the result of such faith (or lack there of). Having to rethink why you believe something will either lead you to believe something new, or will strengthen your belief. Lists like this just further strengthen my faith in God because they require me to look at my faith from the side of the faithless, and shows me that my side (and my faith) and worth the fight and that I do not envy those on the other side.
*One little thing to think about*
Whether you believe in God or not, if you’re wrong- which side has more to lose? Think about it!
November 23rd, 2008 at 7:18 am
I don’t believe in any faith.
I don’t believe in god.
I believe there is no war.
I don’t believe in any existence, as there is no existence, especially when I fall asleep.
Neither have I believed in reasons. What a grand illusion is going on?
February 17th, 2009 at 12:24 am
I have posted this comment to show my support. I must say, in an attempt to appease predicted interest, that my religious tendencies are not, I suspect, the same as any of yours for it is very off-beat; but I believe this is irrelevant.
I just wanted to congratulate all of you for your arguments because it is so important to express one’s feelings on the subject of religion/spirituality.
Please consider this: no matter what any of you believes, your beliefs will colour your world - they are the glasses through which you see your own life. In this discussion you are not, from an outsider’s point-of-view, defining God. Instead, you are defining yourself.
March 16th, 2009 at 3:05 pm
It might be worth clarifying the difference between pain and suffering for the purpose of focusing the debate on reason #7. Even the dictionary does a poor job of clarifying the subtle yet important distinction between the two words. Pain is usually defined as “physical suffering,” yet the word, pain, is one of those origin words problematic to the dictionary. Pain is what it is. It is a physical experience, and no other word can stand in its place for its definition. If you ask me to define pain, I might better just punch you in the face and say, “What you feel right now is a form of pain.” Suffering however is not relegated to a physical experience, it is the physical, mental and emotional pain that is generated when we fight physical pain, undesirable circumstances, or when our will has been defeated by “the world’s will.” Many people who “suffer” from chronic pain find amazing benefits from meditation, which stills their minds, and cleanses them from their suffering, leaving only the physical pain. I would make the claim that pain is inherent in the design of our biology, therefor designed by “God.” This ability to experience pain, as any doctor or biologist will tell you, benefits us. It clues us into illness in our bodies, dangerous situations or experiences we should avoid in the future. Pain often protects us over the long haul. Death is not painful, but the injuries or illnesses that cause death can be very painful. This is another important distinction. Suffering, which is often used as a reason that God cannot exist, is a human experience, willed by us, not God. We resist pain, our bodies on the other hand choose pain, and actively conspire to experience it. If you get a headache, you immediately feel pain. You also immediately begin to attempt to will it away. Ironically enough, we even say, “God, I wish this damned headache would go away.” But our headache is being caused by our God given bodies. It’s saying, for example, “You are carrying a lot of tension right now” in the case of a tension headache. Now think about this. If your mother dies, you experience no actual physical pain. You do however experience much suffering (assuming she was a good mother). Your will was defeated by the will of God/higher power/universal design/etc. All the suffering you will experience will not original in your physical body, but in your mental processes (which do however have an impact on our bodies). A good way of seeing what I mean is to think about your breathing. As soon as I say focus on your breathing, you are in control of it. Your will is affecting your breathing. You are in control. But tonight when you go to sleep, who is controlling your breathing? Or when you are absorbed in a great movie or book, who is controlling your breathing then? Since you can choose to control it, that must mean someone is in control of it when you are not. You might initially say, well, my body is in control of it. This is an interesting choice of words. In this case, you are separating your identity from your body, but when you experience pain through your body, your thinking will say, “I am in so much pain. I am suffering here!” No one (except some Beverly Hills trophy wives perhaps) choose their bodies. We were born. We did not choose that either. We were our bodies before we were anything else. In the beginning, we don’t even know that those cute little fingers in front of our eyes are our own. We begin to experience our bodies through our sensations, and our brains begin to decipher these sensations. Our brains are fundamentally what controls our movement. Plants do not have brains because they root and do not make active decisions about where to move. Normally by age two, we begin what is called “the terrible twos.” This is when our brains have begun to understand that our own will is not always the will of others, and this revelation (as any parent knows) is met with great opposition. I have often seen this stage of going through the terrible twos as a metaphor for those who say “God cannot exist because he CAUSES suffering.” We all experience this frame of mind at various times, but some people are in an almost constant state of it. In this way, they are like the two year old throwing a tantrum because their “Father” won’t let them have what they want. So, I hope I have shown that pain is a rather useful biological ability that often protects or educates us about what we are doing to our bodies, that suffering is a result of our own will power’s fight against pain or unwanted experiences, and that the existence of suffering (which both Buddha and I will tell you there is plenty of in the world) does not prove nor disprove the existence of a God. It proves that our brains (the residence of will) can cause us as much harm as good if misused. The appropriate scientist would tell you that your brain exists for the purpose of sustaining your existence and to aid you in meeting your primary drives (i.e. hunger, thirst, sleep, sex, self protection). Our brains generate thoughts, but they are the blueprints for action. When our thoughts generate no tangible effects, they are not operating as designed. For example, if my brain says to me, “Donn, why are you so winded from climbing those two flights of stairs? That’s pathetic,” then my brain expects a desired outcome (i.e. diet and exercise so I operate more healthily). All our thinking, positive and negative, has its roots in an instinctual desire for self-preservation. This is God given. When our egos (some might call this “the devil”) come up with excuses to be lazy, give up, take the easy way out, etc. we are choosing our will over the inherent will of God inside ourselves that exists as instinctive behavior. When a baby is born, no one teaches her to suckle her mother’s breast (or bottle). That is instinct. The more one looks at the inherent design of our biology, the more one would be inclined to see a breathtaking design within it. If I see a really cool graffiti artist painting a picture on the side of a building, I admire it and immediately go up to him and say, “Wow, this is really cool. “ I am honored to meet the artist. When we recognize and appreciate great design, it is natural to want to meet and/or acknowledge the artist, designer, builder, etc. When I hike the oceanside trails at Big Sur, CA or scuba dive off Oahu at night and watch the angelic Manta Rays gliding overhead, I am overcome with awe at the design of nature. For me, I am inclined to respect nature’s designer whoever that might be.
Let’s not forget that the origins of war can be seen watching any Discovery Channel special on lions, when we see them feeding on a fresh kill and they are snarling amongst themselves, fighting amongst each other for valuable resources. The fight to exist is natural. No one is going to bring the lion up on gazelle-slaughter charges and incarcerate him. We have, however, taken the fight for survival and warped it into the fight for (will) POWER. The lion doesn’t say, “I’m more important than you, therefore I should be able to feed on this gazelle at your expense, fellow lion.” He simply honors his instinct for self-preservation. Mankind has gone beyond this individual instinct to say, “We matter more than you guys” or “Our nation’s well being is more important than your nation’s well being.” We have magnified the scope of this individual instinct to fight for our lives. In this way, it’s a mistake to say that religious wars and injustices somehow negate the existence of a God. In fact, they do the opposite. They prove that the God-given instinct for self-preservation can be exponentially exploited by human will (which resides in our brains). This also explains the overwhelming appeal of American capitalism. It’s very much an individualistic self-protecting, self-beneficial way of existing that honors our God-given instincts while also allowing our own will power to dream big and shoot for the sky.
Many of the arguments listed here that attempt to provide reasons to not believe in God actually do a better job providing reasons to believe in a God. Reason #9 (which I like to call the smart ass approach to argumentation) makes a huge mistake by using law’s of physics to create a invalid outcome. If God made all things (meaning all matter) and all things are made out of atoms and molecules that can be arranged to form the common (and thus far known) elements that behave in ways, so far, of which we have a basic understanding (i.e. the laws of physics), then asking if God can make a boulder so large he cannot lift it is essentially an idiotic assertion. Firstly, it is written in such a way that God/the universal creator/etc. is humanized. Does the sky hold up the heavens? Do mountains get bored? Do rivers ever get tired? These sort of questions prescribe human limitations or conditions to things that aren’t human. No religion suggests that God is originally a human being (though some believe that there have been human being who were divine expressions of God). You might as well ask, “Can God fart?” or “Can God kill himself?” This argument, which comes up a lot in these sort of debates, disguises itself as high logic when even a novice logician would laugh at its line of reasoning. Reason #9 does nothing to neither encourage nor discourage people from believing in a God.
Reason #8 is a juicy topic for me. This is one of the truly mysterious, unknowns. It’s fallacy is that again it sort of assumes God is some sort of being, in the way we understand we are a being. Time, which is an abstract thing, is really best described as the transpiration of matter. For example, we say “Remember that time you jumped off the roof and broke your ankle?” or “We’ve been sitting here a long time.” Our primitive clocks and calendars functioned by the rising and setting of the sun, the seasons, events that occurred regularly. Now, we use atomic clocks that use the resonate frequency that electrons give off when they change energy levels, which basically means a very steady frequency wave that can be measured. So time is in a sense movement or the behavior of all the things in the universe. Thus the phrase “Time stood still.” The better and more interesting debate this reason #9 brings up is “Was there ever a ‘time’ when everything was still?” meaning “Was there a time before time?” which also begs the question “If most religions suggest that God is the beginning and the end, the original creator, then was there a time before God?” or “Is God time?” These are more original ideas to discuss, as #8 makes a mistake in assuming that “…God created the universe…” when many religions believe that God is the universe. “Could God be the design of the universe?” or “Could God be the design that always was, meaning creatorless?” These are all better ways of following the jist of what Reason #8 attempts to bring up and would be a great place to form debate.
Reason #6 fails to acknowledge that the phrase “personal satisfaction” is a phrase used to humanize a God experience. As human beings we experience personal satisfaction, often from getting what we want or from seeing our plans come to fruition. “Love” from God is often incorrectly defined. God’s love is not romantic, it’s more like the way a tree’s leaves love the sun or fish love the water. The all-loving nature of God mentioned particularly in Judeo-Christian religion perhaps should be read to mean a kind of love that human being do not experience, yet the religious text attempts to help people understand. The lion loves the gazelle, without which he would perish. The mountain stream loves the rocks that block its trajectory for they form its path. In this definition, love is defined more as an inherent and beautiful relationship between things. Anything that displays clearly a law of physics is most often revered by humanity. Rainbows display the nature of light in a clear way. We love clarity. Clarity helps us see God. God, assuming the existence of God, doesn’t need a reason to be all-loving. As Judeo-Christian theology says, “God is love.” God isn’t motivated by love, the same way the sun doesn’t need a reason to shine. The sun shines. Many religions engender their God(s). This seems to be more metaphoric and purposeful than literal. Judeo-Christian and Muslim religion view their life-giving God as male, who plants the seed inside the fertile soil of woman. Native American and South American religions often view Mother Earth as a woman, she who gives birth to life. These cultures have their own reason for becoming matriarchal or patriarchal and this usually informs the gender of how they view their creator. Ultimately, the humanizing of God does a lot of good for believers because it helps them feel related to their God. Being “Children of God” or being made in “His image” helps us feel connected and related to God, but when debating the existence of God, this engenderment complicates unnecessarily and neither proves or disproves the existence of a God.
Reason #5 tries to use the Judeo-Christian belief of God-given free will to negate the existence of God. As an adjective, the word, omniscient, means “to have unlimited knowledge, understanding or understanding; perceiving all things.” If God created all things, or if God is the design in all things, then it goes without saying that God perceives all things and knows all things by the act that God is the nature and design in all things. The God-knowing isn’t the same as a fortuneteller. It isn’t an imagined or envisioned knowing. The knowledge of God is functional, the way the heart knows it’s future is to keep pumping, or the way the river knows its nature and not the ocean into which it is headed. God as designer of the entire fabric of the universe has woven every thread, spun each thread. There is an intimate knowing about us, similar to the knowing a heart surgeon experiences the first time she massages a heart into beating. She has had a metaphoric experience similar to the Godly life-giving being-ness of God, or the experience a couple has when the woman gives birth to their child. Reason #5 seems to simply be attacking the Judeo-Christian notion of God-given free will, but proving or disproving that does not prove or disprove the existence of a God or reasons to believe or not believe in such a God.
Reason #4 is easy to dismantle. If human beings have failed to describe God through their varying forms of worship, does that mean God doesn’t exist? That’s like saying if I don’t know what’s behind Door #2 then nothing is behind it. Assuming the existence of an original designer/creator, that creator has created all creatures, all races who have created their own cultures and religions. We did not create the universe, so we fumble around trying to understand why the universe is designed as it is. Why the food chain? Why not create all creatures to just be alive? So the lion can sleep 24 hours a day instead of 18 hours. So the butterfly is born as a butterfly instead of gong through its metamorphosis. Why not simplify everything so that nothing is as magnificent and beautifully designed as it is? Because we are not God. We rape our women, molest our children, toss our trash out our windows, procreate then dispose of our unwanted fetuses, we manipulate people, and then wonder what idiot designed our highways as we sit in rush hour traffic. We make mistakes then lie about them. We cover up the truth. God is truth. Let’s not negate the existence of God because of the errors of mankind.
Reason #3 assumes the universe is imperfect. That’s as ridiculous as looking up into the night sky and suggesting that the stars are arranged all wrong, or evaluating the artistic composition of the Grand Canyon. Our imperfections (sinful nature) come from our evolved brains (and their inherent ego construction which manifests itself as will power). Reason #3 suggests that we “should reflect the qualities of our creator…” and forms the argument that if we are imperfect then we are not reflecting the qualities of our creator. The “qualities” of our creator were not defined. I’m made out of atoms, molecules, cells, tissues, and systems. I am more similar biologically to all animals than I am different. On a molecular level I’m similar to all plant life, and on an atomic level I am like everything including the stars. If God is everything, then I am in fact made in his image, because every cell in my body obeys the natural design.
Reson #2 says that evil exists and yet fails to define evil, fails to prove it’s existence, and fails to demonstrate how the existence of evil proves God doesn’t exist. The phrase “sin against God” suggest that we, as human beings, sometimes choose to exert our wills in a way that goes against the laws of nature, natural design. Almost all societies do not approve of a man murdering another man, yet most willingly support going to war, especially if fighting for land, rights, survival. American law protects a man who acts in self-defense. If you attack me with a knife and in the process of fighting for my own survival end up killing you, I have acted instinctually on a certain level. Yet we neglect our children, many of who grow up maladjusted and suffer from mental illness. When those people become serial killers, we label their acts evil. Yet we were the farmers of those “evil plants.” We use the term evil to dehumanize behavior that scares us, shames us, or makes us look bad. We create conspiracy theories for 9/11 because we don’t want to face the real terror that at any moment bad things can happen. Evil, conspiracy theories, drugs, alcohol, tv, junk food, video games, etc can all become distractions from facing our feelings, our humanity. I’m sure most of you have noticed that the word “EVIL” is the word LIVE backwards. Which is exactly what we usually label evil. When people destroy life, treat life poorly, they are acting evil. Species evolve, mutate, accidents happen, variation makes sure of this. Our own evolution has caused this opportunity for a sinful nature. In the story of creation in Genesis, Eve eats from the tree of knowledge. This ancient story suggests that our intelligence is our gift and our flaw. Free will gives us the freedom to follow God’s will or to fight it, much like the story of the devil, who was a fallen angel of God who wished to defy God. All these are metaphoric stories to explain our human condition. Lots of wisdom can be found from living the truth in them.
Faithlessness and depression are not reasons to doubt God. Depression has been proven to be caused by chemical imbalances in our bodies due to known and still unknown factors. Faithlessness doesn’t disprove God, it merely proves the existence of our own fragile egos and the effects of failed will on our attitudes and thinking. “God doesn’t exist because he’s treated me like shit my whole life.” is the kind of thinking that proves a belief in God. When people say, “I’m doubting my belief in God because of this awful thing that just happened to me” I shake my head because what they are saying is, “I thought God was going to kiss it and make everything all better, but since he didn’t I hate him.” Again this goes back to the two-year-old child throwing a tantrum metaphor I brought up earlier.
I find these debates entertaining because it’s usually religious people trying to feel better about themselves and the non-religious trying to show the religious how stupid they are for being tricked into their religion. But this is what I know: We all want to be God. We all want control. When we are walking down the alley and the man jumps out and abducts us, we immediately and instinctually scream out, “Oh God, no!” When we look at a beautiful painting and say, “Wow, it looks so real” we are saying “He did a good job of attempting to duplicate nature.” Our lives are swirling around control, illusions of control, attempts to duplicate nature or improve upon it. When I cut myself, my wound heals by a force that operates without my supervision. We sure spend a lot of time competing with, challenging, debating, trying to figure out and cussing at something that doesn’t exist.
March 26th, 2009 at 11:09 pm
Open up a Bible and read
God Bless
May 6th, 2009 at 10:37 am
this is crap
May 27th, 2009 at 9:51 am
The bottom line is that there are no logically sound reasons to believe in any God, or any other supernatural being. There is absolutely no evidence of ANY of the gods in any religion existing, and their existence cannot be explained rationally. Everything around us that has any connection to reality can be explained with reason and rationality. So if religions have any connection to reality, they should be able to be explained by reason and rationality also, but they can’t.
And don’t even begin to pull out the argument, “Well the bible says you just have to have faith that God exists”. This is nothing more than the mother of all cop-outs. Faith is what is pulled out when arguments based on reason, rationality, and solid proof fail miserably. Faith is not a logically valid reason for forming beliefs. If we accepted faith as a valid reason, there would be no such thing as truth or falsehood.
Think about it. Let’s say someone has faith that the Boogieman exists. They have no evidence, but they have faith in it. If we accepted faith as a valid reason for believing something, then by that logic, this person who believes in the Boogieman based on faith can’t be wrong. And no one else who believes in anything based on faith could ever be wrong either. The whole thing would fall apart at this point, because there would no longer be any way to distinguish between truth and falsehood.
So how do we distinguish between truth and falsehood? By using reason and rationality. They are the best tools us humans have for arriving at true beliefs. And since no religion can be explained using reason and rationality, there is no good reason to believe any religion is true.
Obviously, I’m a non-believer. But I would consider myself an Agnostic, because if there ever were solid evidence discovered in favor of a god existing, I would be willing to examine the evidence, then believe if the evidence were compelling enough. However, at this point in time, the existence of a god is something that is unknown and logically impossible to determine. Hopefully that will change one day, but as of today, no one knows, so all the religious people who think they are right need to re-examine their own beliefs first.
So until there is some evidence available in favor of a god, or the existence of a god can be explained with reason and rationality, we have no good reason to believe in any god. However, the bottom line is I don’t know whether or not a god actually does exist, AND NEITHER DO YOU.
May 28th, 2009 at 1:13 am
Interesting that most arguments “for” the side of god and religion all point to reference a book that was written in the bronze age, authored and edited by ALL men, at the earliest 60 years AFTER the death of Jesus (if he existed).
I ask you all - what other information of this validity do you so profoundly base your lives on? Think it through, folks. Our entire society is based on principles that were founded by people who didn’t know what science was, that the earth was round (or that it was even called earth) or that a female period wasn’t a curse from god because of an apple and a talking snake. Yes, let’s base our entire lives, society and culture around this piece of literature. Makes perfect sense.
June 14th, 2009 at 8:32 pm
God is not real of course. Who believes in magic? who believes in an excuse called faith in God? They say God is love but fuck that, you can say what you say but it isn’t true. Religion was passed down before science, including God. Religion was made for why the world was created. Now that we discovored science, we didn’t need religion. Now we just think people are crazy back then. Now look at these people today. They think they are worthy for God and they don’t get anything from him. They only listen to people that tell them God is real. I would like to meet the person who said God was real and he saw him. I’m so pissed that people carry on religion and not see the real world. And its fucked up that people believe in going to heaven “a wonderful place.” Fuck that, your in denyal. Take a look at the real world. It isn’t a beautiful thing, stop believing in God hoping he will save you.
June 17th, 2009 at 9:23 am
what about the people who died before Jesus Christ was born? they went to heaven?
June 22nd, 2009 at 6:06 am
Ten reasons to believe in God
# Are you sure God doesn’t exist? You are willing to contend, aren’t you, that there is a tiny chance that God does exist? If you don’t believe in him, and he DOES exist, you’re screwed. You HAVE A CHOICE. When the day comes to choose who enters Heaven, it is highly doubtful you will be chosen, if you don’t believe. Isn’t it safer just to believe?
# So you have moral dilemmas? They’re annoying, aren’t they? What is right and what is wrong? Who knows? The law? Crap, you cross the street at a red light. God knows what is right and what is wrong. Believe, and all your moral problems are solved. If you are ever stuck again with a moral dilemma, just ask your local priest, rabbi or equivalent. He’ll explain it all to you.
# You have sinned, you know. And you DO know it. Even if you don’t call it sin. So you call it “a mistake”. But you can’t forgive yourself. God knows you’ve tried. You can’t forgive yourself. Well, if God can forgive you, you’ll be able to forgive yourself too. All the major religions have methods of forgiveness. For example:
* Christianity : confession,
* Islam : Ramadan,
* Judaism : Yom Kippur.
# Can you explain infinity? I can’t. I’m talking about two dimensions of infinity. Spacial and temporal. Talk quantum mechanics, and dimension folding all you like, the human mind can never grasp it. I don’t think anyone can comprehend infinity. If you believe in God, no problem.
# You can’t possibly believe that evolution theory completely. Oh, I’ll agree, natural selection exists. Of course it does. Creation theory does not conflict with the belief in natural selection, don’t make any mistakes. Of course, many people believe it does, but that’s mostly because they are misinformed. Natural selection hardly explains Man. And where is that missing link? You can’t possibly believe that Man (a conscious being) originated from the monkey, which is so far below him?
# What happens when we die? Scary, isn’t it? Don’t you have a soul? Of course you do. You can’t possibly, deep in your heart believe that we just die and disintegrate? There has to be an afterlife.
# The bible contains predictions of the future. Many predictions have already happened, so if you are a disbeliever, you can see for yourself. No other book in the world has so many prophetic words and codes interwoven into it as the bible. Many experiments have shown this. Coincidence?
# The world today is full of pornography and gore and is low on moral fiber. You know it’s wrong. And you sure as heck don’t want your children to grow up in such a society. The return to morals is the only solution, and the only way to do that is through BELIEF.
# Most of the world does, in fact, believe in God. How could this be, if God didn’t exist? If you’ve strayed off the path, you must return to it. Everyone was born capable of believing in God. Some haven’t found Him yet, others have lost Him. He WILL take you back.
# Look deep inside your heart. God is there.
July 12th, 2009 at 3:28 pm
I just have to say that people who believe in god are a joke… they blindly follow a book written by man that promotes such atrocities as rape, murder, polygamy, cannibalism(eating the body of christ), and slavery yet says if you dont do these terrible things and believe in a god that cant be seen or have any proof for you are going to hell. If a person who does not believe in Yahweh does wonderful things for people on earth such as feeding the poor, helping the sick, and being an overall good human being but gets sent to hell for not believing in something he/she has no proof or evidence for what kind of loving god is that. SCrew you all
August 12th, 2009 at 4:25 am
The single biggest proof that god does not exist is the bible itself. A book that is the inspired word of god written by men, yet so confusing that you need priests to interpret it. So many interpretations come out that there are THOUSANDS of denominations of christians in the world today. It is the equivalent of ideological babylon(to reference the bible)! Would god inspire the creation of the bible knowing full well the confusion it would cause? Is god some sort of cosmic prankster? Why would he “inspire” chaos? Now let’s see who would want to inspire chaos,…. hmmmmmm. Could it be Satan? Nope, because he doesn’t exist either!
August 14th, 2009 at 3:00 pm
U really need god read the bible. u think we came from monkeys or something. Look at the earth and how beautiful it is
September 12th, 2009 at 11:15 pm
read your Bible dum dum.
every answer is found there.
And just so you know, being a Christian isn’t a religion, it’s a relationship
September 30th, 2009 at 1:56 am
OMGOSH PEOPLE THeSE REASONS R FOULD DISGUSTING NONSENSE! we NEED to get get ppl saved and i KNOW hez real coz God talks to me and my parents AND he has shown himslef. (to us) now u should post “Top 10 reasons TO believe in God”
(btw im 11 sooo this sounds a bit wierd)
September 30th, 2009 at 1:57 am
FOUL*
October 2nd, 2009 at 10:16 pm
I agree with all these points. Basically I see religion as a means of controlling people.
I find theist comebacks amusing.
I’ve searched a lot and here are the common things they say -
-”Prove god DOESN’T exist”
How can you disprove a non-existent object? It is logically impossible to prove that something does not exist, because it never existed in the first place. I can just say “prove Santa Claus doesn’t exist” but it is impossible to.
-”Why not believe JUST IN CASE?”
Evidently people don’t understand what “believe” means. It means whether people think god exists or not. You can’t just choose to think god exists just because you might have a better chance to ‘go to heaven’. In order to believe you need to be convinced by evidence.
-”Look at the beautiful world around you”
‘Beautiful’ is just a way somebody describes something. I can also say that the world is not beautiful. Theists conclude that only god could have created this beautiful world (with no evidence). Scientists have already have a rough estimate that the world was created from matter after the big bang (with evidence).
-”What was before the big bang?”
Theists expect atheists to know everything about the creation of our universe. Do they even know that they’re expecting too much from society? How can anyone prove what was before the big bang at this day and age? Theists conclude that god created the universe-they don’t even attempt to try to discover themselves.
-”Human life came by chance?”
Theists also ask this. I say yes it did, due to complex molecules forming DNA and millions of years of evolution. We have proof of evolution but theists ignore it and claim it was god.
-”I experienced god and saw miracles happen”
These ‘miracles’ could have happened in any way eg(1). if you have a near death accident you claim it to be god who saved your life but it can just be the driver stopping just in time to not hit you. (2) if you prayed for a friend/relative to be cured of a disease and the next day they were cured it could just be that person taking the right medicine.
Also theists say things like ‘I felt god’s touch’. They claim that god is with them even though it is all just INSIDE THEIR HEAD.
Also for all we know they could have made up a story to try convince people.
Hearing voices? Go see a psychiatrist.
Now I ask YOU theists.
There are hundred of gods. Why not believe them all?
Also why not believe in Santa Claus and the tooth fairy?
October 2nd, 2009 at 10:29 pm
I also have one more point
-”Read the bible”
I’ll say this to you theists. The bible is a BOOK. It is nothing to do with god, it was created by man. The bible may contain some mind-blowing ideas but after all it is JUST A BOOK. Why don’t you theists also grab a fairy tale book and believe everything inside it? All I can say is those people who created the bible did a hell of a good job convincing people. Theists are convinced that the bible is god’s creation and everything inside it is fact. They follow it blindly and don’t even question why.
Note: The bible was translated and corrected countless number of times which proves god didn’t make that book because god has to be ‘perfect’.
October 4th, 2009 at 2:24 am
i am currentlyu questioning my belfiefs but seriously come on. These areguments are terrible and nothing that a questioning person would ever ask. I am currently a studying student and am an inspiring attorney. Simple deductive logic can prove 7-10 wron right off the bat. my last bit is here: i came up with a compelling argument for every one of these points just using the one book of genesis and general deductive and inductive logic that anyone should know from their 5th grade class
October 4th, 2009 at 2:29 am
point number 5: simple logic says: just because A happens doesnt mean that B happened and thus will C. The fallacy happens with just because A has happend then A caused B and other things to happen: called the domino effect.
October 4th, 2009 at 2:35 am
well since i just read 44 quickly…. its called faith… thats the argument. Also regardless of if it is a fairytell or not; you cannot logically argue with me that (regardless of if you believe it or not) it is the right way to live. Im not talking about moral stuff but when it goes back to what i learned in undergrad about simple business transactions if we followed the bible we might not be necessarily where we are today (ponzi schemes, exec bonus (which i will fight to the death for), etc).
October 4th, 2009 at 2:42 am
43….. i couldnt get through your entire response…. you touch on logic, great that is awsome you are the only one too. Other that that you believe “the big bang” or “evolution” which have what on the end of them… the word “THEORY” just as christianity believers believe. If you have any argument as your scientific proff of these as you claim to know of…. dr. dyno will pay you 500,000 for scientific proof of evolution or the big bang theory and as will i… illlogical… you have no absolute proff thats why they have the word theory after them!
October 4th, 2009 at 2:48 am
number 38….. well well well…. got one for you… the united states law is so confusing that it needs seperate courts to study specific statutes. Would our fearless leaders ever want us to be confused. How about this our tax code is so confusing that we have to have seperate attorneys and accountants just to interpret it… and guess what the us couldnt deal with the confusing debacule so they had to make its own agency the IRS, this is a whole different argument but it just goes to show you that no matter what political stance you have the statutes are so complicated that even some one like me who goes to school for may years cant even decifer these things… its natural…. its meant to be read like law (my personal belief)
October 18th, 2009 at 1:00 am
Look, man, some people say that God ain’t real ’cause they don’t see how a good God can exsist with all this evil in the world. If God is real then He should stop all this evil, ’cause He’s all-powerful right? What is evil though man? It’s anything that’s against God. It’s anything morally bad or wrong. It’s murder, rape, stealing, lying, cheating. But if we want God to stop evil, do we want Him to stop it all or just a little bit of it? If He stops us from doing evil things, what about lying, or what about our evil thoughts? I mean, where do you stop, the murder level, the lying level, or the thinking level? If we want Him to stop evil, we gotta be consistent, we can’t just pick and choose. That means you and I would be eliminated right? Because we think evil stuff. If that’s true, we should be eliminated! But thanks be to God that Jesus stepped in to save us from our sin! Christ died for all evilness! Repent, turn to Jesus man!”
October 18th, 2009 at 6:01 am
Then who created us?
October 21st, 2009 at 12:47 am
THere is no god, if God exist, were is the prove? no prove, no god.. fuck god!
October 31st, 2009 at 2:07 am
10 reasons? I could come up with about 100 reasons god exists and even more, if you’re an atheist that means you know nothing about religions and you dont know what they teach, in the bible it sais that god will not interfere, what do you exactly expect him to do? click his fingers and make everyones life better? god has not let evil take over the world we have, in the bible it sais that he let satan take over the world and that he would not interfere he let satan take over the world just to prove that there could be no other god other than Jehovah. I sort of follow the Jehovahs witness religion and I have found that they follow every bible scripture and the religion has not caused any war like catholics have, who not only disobeys one of the ten commandments but doesn’t even follow the bible. So there you have it catholics do not follow the original bible and they have caused so many wars over centuries.
October 31st, 2009 at 2:12 am
Number 37: What? The bible does not premote rape, you idiot. If you have never read the bible, since you’re an athiest how do you know what the bible premotes? Get an education.
October 31st, 2009 at 2:19 am
Jim: You can’t question reeligion if you know nothing about, if you read the bible(Which of coarse you havn’t) you would learn that it does not say god created the bible the bible was translated by imperfect beings because Jesus told them to. Are you blind? how could you think we were created by nothing.
October 31st, 2009 at 2:25 am
To rasul: Where is the proof? Go outside and look around you! study the way the universe and our planet works, swim in the sea with an amazing reef under you, think about how a tiny little seed can create a watermelon, the human brain, technology, the human voice, art and more. There is your proof.
November 12th, 2009 at 9:49 am
I must say… Those theists out there who think atheists don’t know religion are the real ones that know nothing. I am an atheist and went to church for the first, 16 years of my life, being taught the bible, and reading the ENTIRE thing. The bible is a book, with a ton of stories in it, that don’t prove God anything more than reading The Lord of the Rings proves hobbits, or goblins are real. They are just stories, created by men to explain what hadn’t been explained at that date and time.
And to #48, at least there is SOME physical evidence to support the idea of evolution, and other scientific theories on why or how we got here. Creationists have… well no evidence at all. Its illogical.
to #56 everything you said has evidence on how it came to be. Reefs are just thousands of years of dead organisms stacked on top of each other. A seed grows by having its cells multiply, the human brain was developed over millions of years very slowly just like everything else was. Voice, like all sounds, are just tiny vibrations, that’s all. None of that has anything to do with a god or supreme ruler.
And to everyone else on here. You are interpreting what an atheist is wrong. We don’t believe in a god, but who said we believed we were created, as stated by #55. How can we think we were created by nothing? Simple… we don’t. We evolved into what we are, we weren’t created.
If anyone can give me even 1 good reason why god could possibly exist without that reason being in any part tampered with by opinion, then do it. Faith is an opinion with the person who has it, because obviously not everyone does. I challenge anyone who can give me a calm rational argument, not some “you just need to read the bible, or your going to hell” opinionated arguments. I will give you my thoughts on your response.
Now I also do not believe in forcing your thoughts onto others. If you are a christian, so be it, I have no right to tell you what you should think, all I am doing is stating what evidence has been brought forth.
that also means that Christians, or any theist should also not have the right to tell us we are wrong either, but bring what they have as evidence out to support there ideas. As of now, they just don’t have any.
November 18th, 2009 at 12:56 am
10. War? really? God lets man have a choice, and its man’s choice to start a war.
9.Paradox? What the crap? If anything God can make something that he can’t lift, after failing at lifting it he will lift it. same thing with the question.
8.God wasn’t created, he was always there. He was there an eternity ago and he will be there for eternity, you just can’t imagine something happening for an eternity but you can believe in an expansion which there is no proof of whatsoever.
7.There is suffering because of human error. We sinned and we must pay the consequences, and God also gives troubles to the ones he loves, as a test.
6.Reason to exist and live is to have an eternal life with God, to praise and worship him, and nobody can answer that, only God truly knows why he created us, try to make it up to heaven and ask him yourself.
5.God can do anything, of course he knows everything, and you still chose that red shirt, see you still had a choice, its not like the bible opened up or God directly told you what to do, you just did it yourself.
4.Of course no religion can be correct in describing God, because we are human, we are bound to make errors, we were the one that made our own little separate religions.
3.We are human beings being tempted by the devil. Adam and Eve were perfect but once they were tempted by the devil and sinned they became what you can say unperfect. There are those who try to be righteous but its difficult for a human with those temptations out there.
2.There is evil because an angel thought he could be better than God, which we know as the devil. so you can say ever since then the devil has been trying to get more powerful than God. Devil tempts humans they go into sin, and there is evil in the world.
1. The devil effects you, like i’ve explained before.
That’s why its called FAITH. you have to believe there might not be as a much evidence out there but that’s the thing you have to believe. like in evolution you have to first believe in the big bang before you can believe in the evidence out there trying to prove it.
also this is general i’m not too crazy educated but gave it a shot.
November 22nd, 2009 at 11:53 pm
I’ve been included in taxes for longer then I care to acknowledge, both on the personal side (all my working life-time!!) and from a legal stand since satisfying the bar and following up on tax law. I’ve provided a lot of advice and righted a lot of wrongs, and I must say that what you’ve posted makes complete sense. Please carry on the good work - the more individuals know the better they’ll be armed to comprehend with the tax man, and that’s what it’s all about.
January 2nd, 2010 at 2:06 pm
One day I am going to post a be-all-end-all resource for arguments in favor of atheism because I’d like one clean page to point believers to when they ask for my position. A summary since I’m about to go to bed: God isn’t real and believing in God is silly.
January 2nd, 2010 at 5:03 pm
Dear everyone,
I admire all of you for your arguments and devotion to your beliefs. Now, I have an individual message for two groups of you.
Athiest,
Although some of your points are rational,, they do not disprove Christianity nor will they weaken any True Christian’s faith. If you continue to hold to your athiest beliefs, you will, with out question, go to hell after the Great White Throne judgement. I am not saying this in a vindictive, judgemental, or wrathful way. I’m simply informing you of the obvious.
Christians,
Do not argue with the athiest. The Bible says, that if you argue with a fool, you become one. Simply inform them that Jesus died on the cross for there sins because he loves them and he patiently awaits there prayer of repentence and confession of love towards him. Arguing is pointless regarding Christianity or any other religion. We are Christians! We are supposed to love God, love people, and live the Gospel.
Start doing just that.
I will keep you all in my prayers.
God Speed,
Trevor Smith
January 11th, 2010 at 3:34 pm
I would tend to dis agree with these reasons. God doen not force you to do anything. You do have a free will. God gives us laws so that we will live a life free of sin and evil in out hearts. He does not promise a life free of pain. but He does promise a life in eternity from pain afer we either die or the rapture. Also when you believe in God then you will beable to reconize the good and the bad. You have heard it asked “why to bad things happen to good people”. No man is good save God alone. So when we Believers expirience trials and hardships it only means that through thoes times they will be able to see God in thoes situations more. Believing in God is the ultimate time to discover truth and forgiveness.
January 13th, 2010 at 2:46 pm
Religion is the course of most war. Look it up people. The Crusades were just loads of Christians trying to kill other people in religions (ok not just Christians, other religions as well)
In 16th Century France there was a succession of wars between Roman Catholics and Protestants. These series of wars were known as the Wars of Religion.
The English civil war was partely about religion. Charles was trying to change England from protestant to Catholic, and some people got annoyed.
In the first half of the 17th century, the German states, Scandinavia, and Poland were fighting on behalf of religion. Roman Catholicism and Calvinism figured in the opposing sides of this conflict.
The Second Sudanese Civil War was coursed by the central Arab governments who had been trying to exploit the Roman Catholic since the 17 century.
The Indian Rebellion of 1857 was partially coursed by missionaries speaking ill of Hinduism and Islam.
And these are just some of the hundreds.
January 13th, 2010 at 7:00 pm
To post 63:
Yes, there have been, still are, and always will be wars fought over religion due to the passion and controversy involved with it.
That doesn’t do anything to prove the non existence of God.
Do you not believe the sun is there even in darkness?
Do you not believe in love even in lonliness?
Do you not believe in the air even though you can’t see it?
Why is it so hard for you to grasp the truth, that there is a God?
God can NOT be understood, try as you wish.
God has changed my life. I hope he reachd yours, my friend.
God bless,
Trevor Smith
February 8th, 2010 at 10:56 pm
really people talk aboutthe reasons of war, but if you think about all the missionaries that killed other people in order to make them believe in god. Is it really HOLY to kill people to believe something they dont choose to. Didnt the bible say that humans shouldnt kill.To me the whole bible buisness is a scam. I believe in god but, the holy church stuff I interpret as a big scam for money. ( i think i just contradicted my self, but you get the boint)
My religion class nun in polish school( man that was a long time ago)once said all the things we should think say listen to (as in music)or wear. To me it seems like the church is against everything , i mean God gave us free will, but the bible gives us special rules to live a holy war and believe in god. I dont know but that doesnt seem so free willish if god also gave us a concience , and a sence of wrong and evil. Hope you get what i mean .
February 13th, 2010 at 4:18 am
Believing in God is being shallow and ignorant and you’re just trying to escape the truth that there is no God.
You need attention, and the solution to your problem is you to find a real friend that DOES exist and can really listen and talk to you, because every people praying to God needs help, they got issues and they need to get away from these issues.
Get out of your fictional world and go into the real world… into life…
March 3rd, 2010 at 12:28 am
by the way, while you are all writing your statements against God and his people, calling us shallow and ignorant. Jesus is still loving you, wanting you to accept him in your heart. so that you may live forever, in peace and harmony in his Kingdom, for all eternity. Amen
March 8th, 2010 at 1:10 pm
why is it fair for believers to say “you’ll go to hell if you dont believe”??? what about people that live in tribes and have never seen modern civilisation, and if they are good people, would they still go to hell? Is that fair?